Critical Edge: Cut Off Your Nose to Spite Your Face?

[Jaxel]

However, less than 10 feet away everything is just fine and dandy with the rotations on the TTT2 arcade cabinets!

The TTT2 cabinets had forced rotation. The game itself would kick people off after a few matches, so policing wasn't needed for TTT2 the same way it was for SC5.

 

[songohanx]

So I guess expecting people to have enough courtesy to take turns without being told via megaphone is expecting too much? lol

 

[soakrates]

In 2009, I felt that SC4 did well enough at EVO to return for 2010, especially when there wasn’t a suitable replacement which is why the last game for that year was brought to a vote. Everyone had the sentiment that Soulcalibur wasn’t going to be back for whatever reason, so if EVO wanted to show their support towards us, they could have just kept the decision to themselves and brought the game on for another year. But SC had 0 chance in a vote left mainly in the hands of the 2D crowd with a history of being segregated and hostile towards us. I appreciated the support Ponder gave us, but we had no chance compared to amount of people who are on SRK at that time. Maybe things could have been different with some reassurance, but who knows, that's all in the past now.

And for whatever reason, they felt differently. Maybe it was because SC4 was largely viewed as broken at the time and they feared a huge player drop-off. Whatever the case, they just didn't have the confidence that putting a lot of hard work and resources into featuring SC4 at Evo would result in solid attendance. Given the reaction SC4 (i.e., Hilde) received and the massive bitchfest in the community that had been going on for some time, I'd say their concerns were at least somewhat well-placed.

Whether or not it was left up to 2D players (which is basically saying it was left up to most fighting game players, but hey) is barely relevant, because even different 2D games have very different audiences, and non-Capcom games had trouble gaining acceptance well before SF4 and Marvel 3 came into the picture. The fact is, there were more Melty Blood players willing to step up to the plate to support their game than there were SC4 players, and it showed. Evo organizers did what they could to make the process as inclusive as possible. It baffles me that people are still so butthurt about this.

To soakrates points, the Soulcalibur community is already severed from the rest of the fighting game community. If we weren’t, then we’d all be on SRK happy as a clam. I’m all about supporting whoever wants to help blow up SCV, doesn’t matter who. And it’s not about severing ourselves from the people who’ve supported us, but separating ourselves from the few vocal people in the Capcom side of the community who feel that nothing good can come from eSports.

So the fact that 8WR members aren't on SRK en masse is your evidence that SC is somehow cut off from the rest of the FGC, even though SRK has done a lot to publicize SC5, even though there is palpable excitement for SC5 in the SRK community, even though many SC players also play other fighting games, even though SC4 has been at a ton of majors, and even though a significant number of well-known 2D players have said they will be picking up SC5. Surely you are intelligent enough to realize how stupid this sounds.

And again, the opinion that "nothing good can come from eSports" is not nearly as widely shared as you and Jaxel are making it out to be. Many prominent people in the FGC have stated very plainly that they believe the FGC can work with pro-gaming leagues, so long as there is enough understanding on both sides to prevent fighting games from being bastardized.

snip

MLG didn't pick up VF5, WCG did. I don't know how it went exactly, but the response by the VF community seemed pretty lukewarm at the time. I don't know how things happened with GG and Smash at Evo. Mistakes may have been made, but the Smash community, for its part, has done fine outside of all the community in-fighting.

And why are we even talking about "competing" with Capcom games? Many SC players, myself included, ENJOY Capcom games. There have been great strides made in getting Capcom players to adopt SC5. We gain nothing, and in fact stand to lose a whole lot, by alienating ourselves from the rest of the FGC.

It is quite possible that if other fighting game series hoist themselves on the Capcom/EVO banner, they could go down with the ship come 2013-14 or so. UMVC3 hasn't sold that well. AE hasn't wowed people all that much. SFvsTK is probably going to get horrible reviews (seriously, game reviewers I've talked to are calling Capcom stupid, and it's quite possible SFvsTK will be a bad game even without the gem issue) You need to build a scene that can last and grow outside of the Capcom scene.

A game's sales numbers are hardly an indicator of its competitive longevity. MK9 sold a lot more than SF4 and Marvel, but despite a nice sprint out of the gate, its popularity in tournaments has dwindled massively in the last several months. It's true that SFxT is looking more and more like a huge misstep, but there is renewed interest in AE after the release of ver. 2012 and Marvel is still growing in popularity. Whether or not it can be sustained is anyone's guess, but keep in mind that Evo still grew in attendance year after year when fighting games were in the doldrums.

 

[Alstein]

I was in the VF5 community at the time. The response was positive, the problem was the community was so damn small that it didn't matter.

As for MK9, it did well at Evo, but died afterwards, KOF has taken over MK9's spot here. SC4 has proven that folks still show up for it- look at NEC.

Locally, I haven't seen AE draw anyone back to that game, the folks who left for AE are largely now playing KOF or Marvel here. UMVC3 will be the big game at Evo next year, but I don't think it will draw much more then it did last year (new players will counteract that folks who left).

 

[microgamer]

I just wanted to say that I'm glad that this isn't on the front page anymore.