CNP
[09] Warrior
Oh yeah. Chess has more depth than VF... and it's just as flashy. O_o
Opinion: Where Do Fighting Games Go From Here?
- Thread starter BlackDragon37
- Start date
KowtowRobinson
[10] Knight
I actually enjoy watching VF matches more than SC matches, I just couldn't justify putting the effort in for the throw breaks. But the flash doesn't come naturally, some of the more advanced combos look cool, but aren't made apparent, even with VF4's comprehensive training mode.
Interesting article overall, but just judging from a lot of the responses in this thread, I don't think there IS a way to bridge that gap. Problem is, a lot of the players that aren't already interested in fighting games, DO think pulling off a hadouken is hard. This concept seems foreign to us, because we've been doing it for so long. But what if we make it easier to do? We alienate people who want the challenge of learning and practicing a fighting game, and maybe becoming competitive in it.
Street Fighter specific, only thing I could think off the top of my head is a more in depth tutorial mode. The challenge mode in this game that lists off combos is a joke, there's no explanation given on how to perform these. I had to look online to find out that you need to dash cancel after landing a Focus attack to pull off certain combos. I shouldn't have to separate myself from the game like that to figure out a mechanic like that. That's one thing that VF4 did try to do with it's combo training, pointing out mistakes you were making (too fast, buffer this in sooner, etc) and even that fell short in some areas.
If a game makes flashy moves easy to pull off, but doesn't show the player the numerous ways that flash can be formed into a strategy, the experience seems like nothing more than two dudes beating the crap out of each other. I'm sure you've heard this from people before, saying there's nothing to fighting games, you just beat someone up and move on. In order to give these games staying power, they need to provide a way of illustrating the layers of depth to new players, beyond just giving instructions on how to do moves.
Interesting article overall, but just judging from a lot of the responses in this thread, I don't think there IS a way to bridge that gap. Problem is, a lot of the players that aren't already interested in fighting games, DO think pulling off a hadouken is hard. This concept seems foreign to us, because we've been doing it for so long. But what if we make it easier to do? We alienate people who want the challenge of learning and practicing a fighting game, and maybe becoming competitive in it.
Street Fighter specific, only thing I could think off the top of my head is a more in depth tutorial mode. The challenge mode in this game that lists off combos is a joke, there's no explanation given on how to perform these. I had to look online to find out that you need to dash cancel after landing a Focus attack to pull off certain combos. I shouldn't have to separate myself from the game like that to figure out a mechanic like that. That's one thing that VF4 did try to do with it's combo training, pointing out mistakes you were making (too fast, buffer this in sooner, etc) and even that fell short in some areas.
If a game makes flashy moves easy to pull off, but doesn't show the player the numerous ways that flash can be formed into a strategy, the experience seems like nothing more than two dudes beating the crap out of each other. I'm sure you've heard this from people before, saying there's nothing to fighting games, you just beat someone up and move on. In order to give these games staying power, they need to provide a way of illustrating the layers of depth to new players, beyond just giving instructions on how to do moves.
Jaxel
Administrator
Yes... so lets play SF4, where the "skill" in the game seems to be based on a player's ability to do the inputs, rather than the ability of a player to read Yomi layers. Almost EVERY move/combo in VF is easy to do (except for rare instances of just-frames like Akira Knee and Byakko). The depth to the game comes from the players, not the complexity of the inputs. Virtua Fighter is actually a very simple game... its only on the extremely high-end scale (which as you said, noobs don't care about), where the game actually gets complicated...
Amazing though, for someone who touts "yomi layers" as much as you do... to not like a game thats based completely on them.
KoshTheKoala
[09] Warrior
imo, SC is technically simple and draws almost all of its depth from "yomi".
SF is very different, being technically one of the hardest games out there, thus mind games won't come into play until far later when actual execution of moves when and where you want them isn't as much of a concern. Reading your opponent's mind doesn't matter if you lack the dexterity to take advantage of the opening. In this situation, SF is actually more like reality, but I find SC more fun as a game.
The question becomes, do you want a game that's more realistic or more fun?
SF is very different, being technically one of the hardest games out there, thus mind games won't come into play until far later when actual execution of moves when and where you want them isn't as much of a concern. Reading your opponent's mind doesn't matter if you lack the dexterity to take advantage of the opening. In this situation, SF is actually more like reality, but I find SC more fun as a game.
The question becomes, do you want a game that's more realistic or more fun?
MrCerebellum
[08] Mercenary
The future of fighting games? Tekken in 3D.