The Athiest Thread

Atheist, Agnostic, Theist


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Well believe what you want to believe. Like honestly, I couldn't care less about other peoples beliefs. To avoid trouble, religion should be kept personal because so many things contradict each other.

I do feel for the atheist, it most be annoying to hear theist babbling about God and how their religion is better...
I just don't like my values being discredited because I don't attribute them to an authority. Plus, the poll right after 9/11 that showed that my fellow American's still trusted Atheist's less than Islamics was an eye opener. We don't have a lot of fans locally, regionally, nationally or globally.
 
Ugh...all these us-and-them mentalities...You guys start loving one another or I'll fucking kill all of you! In the name of God SCIENCE! my imaginary friend Dr. Poopypants. Then it'll be the happy motherfuckers and the dead motherfuckers and there will be no time for tea.
 
Well now. Troll posts aside, this seems like a pretty interesting topic.

Back on track, a question for discussion.

What is the point of it all? What meaning do you derive from life if you don't think you're going to live forever? Some people have answered my previous question about why they do good even though they don't believe in an absolute standard of good, but this question is, "why do anything?" Given that you're going to die, what is the point of all this striving?

Is it to make the world a better place for those around you or those who come after you? Why bother? They're not you, so you won't experience that benefit. I guess the molecules that make you will return to the soil, grow up into the grass and be eaten by cows or rabbits and assimilated into a new person someday, but the thing you call "you" just disappears into the void. No matter what great things you accomplish, all the future (and present) people you're benefiting are, just like you, going to wink out of existence in the same way. And after they do all the striving that, granted, you've made a little easier through your work and sacrifice, they'll be gone just like you and all that will amount to nothing. And the other question is why are some things good, and other things bad anyway? If I hurt someone, or even kill them, we all come to the same end anyway, right? What difference does it make how we get there? Whether me in jail for hitting some guy I don't like with a hammer, or him living the rest of his life as a vegetable?

I guess I am getting back to the same question. Why bother to do good if there is no standard of good to begin with? Just the cold hard truth of death and the universe.

What is important about life? When it's gone, nothing you ever did will matter. Even if you accomplish the most important things and leave a legacy that people will remember for generations, (which very few people manage to do), no matter what you do, nothing will save even those future people from coming to the same inevitable end that you come to, (as though that mattered to you). I guess through scientific advancements maybe you might extend their lifespans, but for what purpose? Just so they can strive longer until they die?

I think, and correct me if I'm wrong, that for the most part, Atheists just try to avoid thinking about this question and live life in the present. Throwing their entire body and soul into building sandcastles that are going to be washed away with the next wave. You work so hard, struggle and sacrifice and for what? So that someone else will reap the benefits. I guess if you focus all your attention on the present and never think about the future, maybe you could derive some meaning from the things you do, but for me, if I thought this was all there is, it would drive me mad. Death just makes life absurd and pointless.

I'll address your first question with a question of my own. If the life we have here is only a precursor to the eternal happiness heaven provides, then what meaning does it really have? I personally don't ascribe to the belief that any part of human beings is eternal. Nor should it be. "Eternity" is a concept that I can't even really get my head around. I mean, humans live at most 70, 80 maybe 100 or so years if they're lucky. When I think of all the time during my short 26 years on this planet that I've spent sitting around bored with nothing to do and project that over an eternity, I don't believe I'd be able to retain my sanity after the first millenia or so. Eventually I'll have learned and done everything there is to learn and do. Then what? I think that the fact our time alive is limited makes it all the more valuable. None of us knows when or how our lives will end, so it's up to us to make the most of the time we have. I think the struggle to find meaning in each of our lives is part of what makes us "human". For some, it's financial success, for others it's starting a family or leaving a legacy. I truly believe that it's the responsibility of each person to give their life meaning.

As far as the question of "why bother to do good if there is no standard of good to begin with?" Allow me to ask, "What IS the standard of good?" Do you even know? I don't believe if you asked this question to a thousand people you'd get the same answer twice. IMO "good" and "evil" are empty abstract concepts that don't really have a basis in real life. What's "good" to some can be viewed as evil by "others". And which of us really has the authority to say who's right or wrong. The big things like not killing or stealing go more toward our continued survival as a species than anything else. Hell, even these things can be rationalized and justified by most. If "good" and "evil" are judged on a sliding scale, then what real basis do they have?

I had a christian upbringing and I ultimately chose to reject that philosophy based on the heaven/hell system itself. Let's take all bias and emotion out of the equation and examine the system itself. The requirements to enter heaven are as follows: 1. Confess with your mouth and believe in your heart that Jesus died for your sins. 2. Accept that the christian god is the "one true God". If you do not meet these requirements at the end of your life, you are sent to hell to suffer for an eternity. The only evidence you have to support these beliefs is text from an unknown group of authors written thousands of years ago and in all likelihood altered due to numerous rewrites and translations. The supposedly omnipotent and all powerful deity that the text describes chooses to remain invisible and only indirectly involved with humans despite having the ability to do so. He instead chooses to make accepting his existence a matter of absolute faith despite offering very little evidence to do so. Those who reject his existence, those who are unsure and those who have not heard his message are all judged equally and sent to suffer for all of eternity regardless of any of the deeds performed during their lives. Now I ask you. Is that a fair system? If you took a survey of all the people alive on the planet right now, an overwhelming majority of them probably wouldn't meet these requirements. Does that really mean they deserve an eternity of suffering?

Now I'll freely admit that growing up in the church was a positive environment for me and that there are many moral lessons to be found in the bible. In fact, church has been a positive influence for a lot of people in all walks of life. If Christianity is what you truly need to believe, then I who am I to question it? But I don't believe religion has any place in politics, medicine, law or any other system that affects the entire population, and the idea of a governing body making religiously motivated decisions quite frankly scares me.
 
there are many moral lessons to be found in the bible.
EXCEPT THAT PART ABOUT A WOMAN BEING RAPED MEANS SHE MUST THEN MARRY THE RAPIST.


THE BIBLE IS EVIL. ALL PEOPLE DO WITH IT TO ADAPT TO MODERN TIMES IS FORGET ABOUT THE BAD STUFF, ACT LIKE IT WAS A MISTAKE, AND THEN FOCUS ON THE PRETTY STUFF.


NO SANE MAN OUGHT TO TAKE RELIGION SERIOUSLY. YOU’RE FUCKED UP IF YOU DO. HAHA, I HATE RELIGIONISTS.
 
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