You're correct in that regard. The string delay is used as a sort of pseudo-frame advantage by psychology. However, the frame disadvantage does not start until the string delay window has expired. So that's where the difficulty comes in is recognizing when the string delay has expired, and the delay differs by string by character. Such as Hayate has to commit to 3H+KK before the 3H+K connects to the opponent, so if you don't see the sweep it means they are in disadvantage.
Dead or Alive 5 Ultimate
- Thread starter UNDERX
- Start date
UnseenWombat
[14] Master
Wait, what? So let's say Hayate does 3H+K, and it's some number of minus frames on block. So his minus frames start before I even block the attack? Effectively making the disadvantage less? Is that what you're saying?
DrakeAldan
Follow the rules!
No no. It's like... You know how you can block a 1A and it's easy to punish, but you block a Pyrrha 236B and you can barely launch punish it?
He's saying that you can have two moves that are -6, but the timing on that -6 is different for both moves. So, if you're expecting it to be the same timing, you can completely miss the -6. Hence a guy smacking you right out of disadvantage, you thought you had it 'cause you blocked but you were too late.
Abare all over the place.
(I have to imagine that this is why online is hell- "blockstun" isn't at all consistent or predictable without experience.)
With 3H+K, there's no delay window (he has to commit to 3H+KK), so if you see 3H+K and there's no followup K sweep, bam, he's negative right away. But that's just for that particular move, for others the timing will be different.
Right, try reacting to Jann Lees' 4PP... It's still in the same animation after the string input window so it's tough to know when the window has expired. You can see this in the Frame Counter when you do a string, notice that the disadvantage doesn't start climbing as long as you can extend the string, but if you try to extend it once it starts climbing - you can't.
And that's what makes it difficult online, because these moves that are -10 or -12, by the time you recognize the window has expired AND the lag for your response is done, then the attacking player who was mashing Punch during their 12 frames of disadvantage ends up interrupting your attack or throw.
And that's what makes it difficult online, because these moves that are -10 or -12, by the time you recognize the window has expired AND the lag for your response is done, then the attacking player who was mashing Punch during their 12 frames of disadvantage ends up interrupting your attack or throw.